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Post by Bayne on May 29, 2003 2:06:50 GMT
Global dispatches has a story where the martians feed with a narwhal like bone spike, while the original book seems to suggest it's done with a transfusion apparatus. So, who favours which interpretaion and why... While we are discussing that, the crystal eggs' winged martians, another species, surgical enhancement, original form (wings chopped off for earth invasion) or worn equipment?
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Post by Charles on May 29, 2003 3:54:08 GMT
Global dispatches has a story where the martians feed with a narwhal like bone spike, while the original book seems to suggest it's done with a transfusion apparatus. So, who favours which interpretaion and why... While we are discussing that, the crystal eggs' winged martians, another species, surgical enhancement, original form (wings chopped off for earth invasion) or worn equipment? "Global Dispatches" cannot be taken as anything other than a tribute to the original story. Whatever was written in there may or may not resemble elements of the original novel, but we should always return to the original text for the authentic view. Wells' text speaks of the injection of blood into the 'recipient canal' by means of 'a little pipette.' That seems clear enough. I think the Martians in "The Crystal Egg" were simply a continuation along a line of evolutionary thought (Huxley's lessons were still fresh in Wells' young mind, after all) which also produced the Martians of "The War of the Worlds." I wouldn't try to establish any relation between these forms of Martians, rather I would take them as speculations on the different possibilities of Martian evolution in the Victorian mind.
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Post by Rob on May 29, 2003 17:12:40 GMT
yeah but still, the idea that martians had evolved the means to drain blood is still cool. You take all the fun out Charles Only joking.
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Post by Bayne on May 30, 2003 1:44:08 GMT
Reading the crystal egg the first time I assumed they were seperate stories, especially with the initial descriptions of the winged martians making them seem a lot more humanoid, however when I reached the parts with the hopping martians and the metallic insect I went back and re-read it.
It seemed to me that it was meant to be connected. The hint of the martians feeding, the gimpse of what may have been a fighting or handling machine. The mystery of the purpose of the eggs.
Well when Wells says the martians were observing the earth with envious eyes, I think it was through the egg and not a telescope. Perhaps England was targeted more because of Mr Cave looking back at the martians than anything else.
There was a line about wondering whether the hopping martians could put on the wings at will, so I reckon the wings are simply a device the martians have created and that the crystal egg martians are the same martians that invade earth.
Personally I like the idea that much of the martian evolution has become artificial, with a reliance on technology for their very existance. Besides, the idea of the martians injecting themselves with huge syringes just has a nasty drug/aids thing going that I find quite horrible (I hate needles) so I'm very much in favour of the transfusion on the grounds of scariness (however I have friends who prefer the Global Dispatches method)
Hmmm... I'm gonna have to re-read the crystal egg today now.
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Post by Necronmaniac on Jun 1, 2003 13:11:37 GMT
Also,
Injection doesnt have to mean needles, drips are another form of intravenous transfusion system. An idea i had recently inspired by the pendragon feeding reservoirs sketches, was that perhaps the humans had some form of two way drip system inserted into various points of their bodies. each "tube" consisted of two channels, one would pump a form of anti coagullent (spelling?) INTO the blood stream to thin the blood whilst the second channel would act as an inverse drip and suck the thinned blood out, essentially working like a mosquito bite does but on a much larger scale, bleeding a human to death. The blood could be collected in a vat type machine and then a martian could attach a number of standard drip feeds to itself and drain the blood out of the machine into itself. Alternatively as opposed to collecting it in a vat, there may simply be some kind of pump involved were the drained blood is passed through the tube and then pumped directly into a waiting martian.
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Post by Bayne on Jun 10, 2003 10:31:40 GMT
I liked the idea of the blood being sucked and/or pumped out more... some poor sod held by a handling machine squirming as their blood is sucked out to the last drop leaving a near dessicated husk... it seems more brutal. I always envisioned something low tech, all glass so you can see each squirt of blood slush into the container and then pump into a syringe jammed into the martian.
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Post by Omega2064 on Jun 23, 2003 15:22:57 GMT
The feeding process is something that rather prys at the mind... doesnt it? Why? A simple enough reason. Because human beings are at their core usually terrified of the thought of being several rungs down on the Food Chain. Its why sharks and other predator animals produce such an ativistic shudder. (And do so well in the movies. heh!)
The idea that the Martians were here not just to conquer, but to EAT us makes them all the more terrible and alien. Well's Narrator even goes on at length about this concept of humanity being reduced to the level of the rabbit or the cow.
Thinking on the Martian feeding process. I get the distinct impression that they liked to feed direct via the smaller pipes and that they got no small pleasure from the feeding. Humans must have been a banquet compared to the spindly bipeds the Martians had.
But there must be a means to feed naturally. I'd guess they either bit and sucked from a food biped on Mars or used some simmilar (portable?) means. The longer V shaped mouth as seen in one illistration might be close if this were true. The Crystal Egg story shows the Martian, (War of the Worlds or non,) hunting and catching a biped. The manner suggested it was intending to drain its prey right there.
But I think the direct bite and blood drain or pipette method was preferred as efficient and considering leisure time durring the invasion was not to be had, efficiency and expedience would be the order of the day.
Omega2064
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Post by Bayne on Jun 24, 2003 1:21:43 GMT
I think what Wells might have been suggesting is that the bipedal food martians were the ancestors of the umm cephalosomatic (for want of a name) martians... that they became so reliant on their technology that they could not eat without it... perhaps they continued to evolve after develpoing technology or perhaps they made themselves that way deliberatly.
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Post by Omega2064 on Jun 24, 2003 2:10:34 GMT
heh! You caught it before I had a chance to make some corrections. Martians dont have digestive tracts so scratch some of the morbid musings.
As for the Bipeds, I meant more that the bipeds though as tall as a human were comparatively (or very) spindly and thus couldnt have produced much in the way of "food" for a Martian. (unless they had a much richer blood than a human. And the Martians reactions seem to indicate that humans were proving a better food source. Or perhaps a more efficiant one. If a single biped could feed one then a human might be able to feed several.
I agree that the Bipeds were most likely the "Neandetall" to the Martians "Homo Sapiens" though even more distantly seperated by evolution. The Martians seem to be Well's idea of what humanity might become if they came to rely more and more on technology.
A simmilar anology is found in the Doctor Who series reguarding the Daleks. Little more than cold near emotionless brains almost totally reliant on their machine bodies. An old Pilot that never made it to a series was The Aliens are Comming wherein this is taken to the next step. Evolution into pure thought and the reliance on machine bodies and posessed humans. The energy form of the invaders have heads that look vaugly like a Martian. Large eyes, tentacles or feelers clustered around a vauguely V shaped mouth area.
The "evolution into disimbodied brain" concept is also seen in the John Carter of Mars series and many other books and even a couple of movies.
War of the Worlds certainly presented an interesting race. Moreso because there are those tantalizing and unanswered questions about so many aspects of the invaders.
Omega2064
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Post by Earthrise on Jun 24, 2003 23:01:40 GMT
I always felt the Martians had evolved a mosquito-like proboscis to drain the enriched fluids of other beings, rather than artificial injection. Unless life on Mars developed along a different tact, it seems it would take a very long time to evolve away from digestion, considering that most life on Earth has some form of digestive tract. Maybe it suggests genetic manipulation, though I wont give Wells credit for predicting that one (at least in this book, Island of Dr. Moreau is a different story). I think Wells was considering the effects on our evolution due to our reliance on machines, the wasting of our limbs, the proportionally increased brain activity and our resulting change in dietary habits.
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Post by Omega2064 on Jun 26, 2003 11:29:13 GMT
The Martian biology leaves alot to speclation doesnt it? Perhaps they havent had a need for a functional or standard digestive tract for a VERY long time. The Martian society was an ancient one and I got the impression they had not changed much in the last 100 years or more likely 1000. But there is no way of telling just how fast a Martian went from a roughly humanoid form to their brain form. They might have made the evolution fairly quickly compared to a human.
But part of that evolution seems coldly calculated. One does not move to a newr strictly artificial means of sustenance slowly or without some planning. Was other food sources running low or no longer able to grow on Mars? (Most likely yes.) Did the supremely logical and far sighted Martians simply decide that the Blood feeding method was the most efficient means to "eat" and shift all functions to this such that the digestive tract atrophied to nothing. (Again, most likely yes.)
Other readers will of course have come to some radically diffrent ideas on these thing. Part of the fun too is seeing how the other fellow looked at the same book yet with a possibly totally variant approach.
Omega2064
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Post by Rob on Jul 18, 2003 17:49:17 GMT
Yeah thats the point of a message board I suppose.
I like to think that although the martians science is massively superior that they are infact naturally evolved. Maybe the beak is an original tool for getting blood from their prey but now they don't use it because it is unhygenic? clumsey?
Think of things we have invented to make our eating much more efficient. we have knives, forks and chopsticks to make our feeding faster and cleaner. We have straws to drink without wastage, we have lots of things that simply speed up what is infact an natural process. If the martians did use artifical means to obtain the blood from victims then it was only to speed up what they could potentially do naturally. Something to think about is the higher gravity of earth and that this may have effected their ability to use their beak.
All speculation of course
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Post by Earthrise on Jul 19, 2003 22:57:57 GMT
Wells intended the Martians to have evolved naturally from a humanoid original. But given the evidence Wells gives us, and our more advanced knowledge, I still opt for artificial evolution. I believe we are approaching a point with Genetics that we will take over natural selection from Mother Nature. If we are getting there now, as Humanoids, imagine where Genetics will take us in 100,000 years (Martians civilisation could be even older than that). Civilisation and natural selection move in different directions, after a point.
Rob, I like the logic regarding Martian eating utensils. The only hole is that it assumes that the Martians originally used natural injection. The original humanoid Martians should have had comparable digestive systems to us, so Wells can make his point about our evolutionary future. They may have started injecting themselves originally then this reliance on artificial digestion atrophied their digestive tract. They then genetically modified themselves, creating the canal (see quote below) for ease of use.
"Let it suffice to say, blood obtained from a still living animal, in most cases from a human being, was run directly by means of a little pipette into the recipient canal." (emphasis is mine)
"Instead, they took the fresh, living blood of other creatures, and INJECTED it into their own veins." (emphasis is the authors)
I really should have gone back to these paragraphs before answering this question originally. I assumed the pipette was organic; retracting just below the mouth. But this suggests the "canal" is organic and the "pipette" is a straw. Maybe the canal has a one-way valve and some method of suction. I also find it hard to accept the blood goes directly into their veins without filtration. Maybe there is some kind of kidney behind the canal.
"Besides this were the bulky lungs, into which the mouth opened".
As I suspected, the mouth is for breathing. Maybe the beak is a cover against red Martian dust, or a filter.
Earthrise, getting there.
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Post by Omega2064 on Jul 20, 2003 18:35:59 GMT
I would guess that the Martians used a combination of pulminary pumping (The fact that the body can and will pump out nearly the full volume of blood given a chance. See Vincent Price in Dr. Phibes for a morbid use of this very method.) The pipe would most likely have a one way valve. I'll talk to a pathologist friend when she gets back from vacation on this.
Also the canal the blood is injected into may have a natural suction pump capacity, though that might not be necessary considering the above. Filtration, if any might be done all along the veins instead of a single organ, or along the main canal vein.
I dont think the lack of vocal cords would be an impediment to the Martian ability to vocalize. Sounds can be shaped by the V shaped lips and the mouth/ throat may be alot more articulate than suspected. Actually they'd have to be, considering the vocal range the Martians are capable of.
The comments on the mathematical qualities of sound bring to mind the thought that the Martians, being so supremely mathematical, may have developed a purely tonal language to convey calculations and even complex ideas. To humans it would indeed sound strange I'd think.
Omega2064
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Post by Bayne on Jul 29, 2003 10:44:15 GMT
[glow=red,2,300]The bit about hooting is making me ponder. The journalist states that it was not communication but merely emptying the lungs to provide suction for the transfusion... Now how would that come into it?
(Sudden mental image of Martian sucking on hose like someone siphoning petrol, and getting a mouthful of blood for it's efforts)
Maybe the Martian is just raising its' blood pressure to help find a good vein![/glow]
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Post by Omega2064 on Aug 2, 2003 7:19:01 GMT
Breathing and pulminary action shouldnt factor together and we see that they are calling quite often when not feeding. (ie: between Fighting Machines.) The mouth and feeding are not connected at all in a Martian as others have pointed out. We tend to want to think in terms we can relate too and in this case Wells is playing on a very diffrent track to put forward the extreem effeciency and advancement of the Martians. And it works quite well too. Much like the Selenites, the Martians are familliar yet alien. And the familliarity makes then all the more alien once the diffrences become apparent. On a related thought though... The vein canal the Martians were injecting into I do not think was normal in that they'd have to jab themselves everytime they wanted to feed. I'd guess the vein had a valve almost like a second (or perhaps true) mouth to fit the feeding pipe into. They've had alot of time and inclination to evolve a system that doesnt require more effort or discomfort to themselves than its worth. Think of the "mouth" as a nostril and the canal as the real mouth. Just come morbid musings. Omega2064 [glow=red,2,300]The bit about hooting is making me ponder. The journalist states that it was not communication but merely emptying the lungs to provide suction for the transfusion... Now how would that come into it? (Sudden mental image of Martian sucking on hose like someone siphoning petrol, and getting a mouthful of blood for it's efforts) Maybe the Martian is just raising its' blood pressure to help find a good vein![/glow]
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Post by Bayne on Sept 14, 2003 3:56:38 GMT
[glow=red,2,300]The sketchwork for the martian design used in Scarlet Traces has a nice little port on one side of the martian where one would normally expect an ear to be. It's a pretty cool idea, but I like the nastiness of the martians jabbing into a vein every suppertime. Whether they would alternate veins to allow the first time to heal, or have a tough vessel specifically for injecting.... Perhaps each Martian has his favourite vein to inject... [/glow]
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Post by Killraven on Sept 30, 2003 11:51:59 GMT
Lack of filtration in the Martian metabolism would explain their accelerated demise from microbial infection, Wells writing "...as soon as the invaders...drank and fed...." On the subject of blood draining, has anyone seen the film "The Abominable Dr Phibes". There is this scene where Vincent Price (Phibes) drains out all Terry-Thomas' blood with a syringe. Utterly ludicrous but still squeamishly terrifying...
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Post by Killraven on Oct 1, 2003 13:01:08 GMT
Woops! Just noticed someone mentioned that in an earlier posting...
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Post by Omega2064 on Oct 10, 2003 17:01:02 GMT
Not quite as ludicrus as we'd like to hope. I questioned a pathologist and she confirmed that the human body can and will pump out virtually the entire contents like that. By accessing the Brachial or Femoral artery the blood will pump itself out with appalling effeciency. For even better results she said to use the Carotid. (dont quote me on the spellings. ) Apparently trying this on most any other vein will not work as the blood flow will stop once the blood pressure equalizes. So now you know what veins the Martians would have targeted depending on the speed of the feeding they were desiring. (and possibly how many were feeding on one individual.) Omega2064 Woops! Just noticed someone mentioned that in an earlier posting...
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