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Post by WaverBoy on Apr 29, 2005 5:59:06 GMT
Bill Warren, author of various reference books on sci-fi films including "Keep Watching The Skies" and "The Evil Dead Companion", made a post at the Mobius Home Video Forum in which he says that Starlog editor Dave McDonnell told him that he learned that the film "doesn't really exist beyond a reel or two shot to try to lure enough investors to complete the movie." I'll be extremely sad if this is true. Pendragon's recent press release indicated that the film was mostly complete, and had already screened in front of enthusiastic test audiences, that it would play theatrically at the end of April, and that the DVD distribution was already locked in. Now that I think about it, and upon re-reading the press release, I tend to think it may be true. After all, I'd think that if anyone would have the skinny on what's REALLY going on with this film, or connections to those who would (and I'm not talking about the filmmakers), the editor of Starlog magazine would be a good bet.
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Post by Ashe Raven on Apr 29, 2005 6:53:09 GMT
The only one with the skinny on whats going on is Mr Hines himself, and because of that, he lossing all credibilty.
Sorry Tim, but you really have to grow up
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Post by tinckelly on Apr 29, 2005 8:49:41 GMT
I'm right up there with the sceptics, over the potentially dubious quality of what Hines might eventually deliver...
BUT...I can't, (or don't want to), believe this rumour true. For a start, can you imagine the legal implications?
If you don't actually have a finished movie, and you know it, there's a big legal difference between saying, a. Please give us money, we want to MAKE/FINISH a movie. (to INVESTORS) or b. Please give us money for a DVD of the movie we HAVE already made. (to JOE PUBLIC)
Wouldn't that be construed as fraud?
Anyone with more legal knowledge please comment/correct etc...
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Post by Rob on Apr 29, 2005 9:22:36 GMT
I really think it does exist, I doubt very much anyone would bother to go to such lengths to get investors interrested. Obviously there are just massive problems getting it distirbuted.
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SEAN
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Post by SEAN on Apr 29, 2005 9:50:23 GMT
That, my friend would appear to be one of the biggest understatements ever!!
Oh well, today I am off to Wales for the weekend so hopefully the weather will be nice!
ta ra!!!
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amber14
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Welsh Bunny
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Post by amber14 on Apr 29, 2005 10:45:37 GMT
Oh well, today I am off to Wales for the weekend so hopefully the weather will be nice! The weather is always nice in Wales ;D
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MarkG
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Post by MarkG on Apr 29, 2005 12:42:28 GMT
What legal implications? I don't think we can win a class action lawsuit against Hines for repeated bullnutsting, though it might be fun to try . I agree though, I no longer believe that Hines even has a movie, I think it's been a fantasy all alone. Of course he may surprise me, but I very much doubt he will.
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Post by tinckelly on Apr 29, 2005 12:57:06 GMT
Well I work in publishing, and when we advertise a book is coming out on a date, and take money in advance orders, we have to be damn sure that we are going to deliver...
If we don't for some reason, there are consequences, financial and potentially legal. All varying degrees of bad.
But if during the production of a book we still took money when we knew it didn't exist, or wouldn't be finished in time, we'd all be in deep nuts. Totally different ball game.
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MarkG
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Post by MarkG on Apr 29, 2005 13:23:08 GMT
Has Pendragon taken anyone's money for this movie?
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Post by tinckelly on Apr 29, 2005 13:27:39 GMT
That (amongst everything else) is what we don't know.
But we do know that money has been taken from the general public for the 'making of' books. Maybe they are going to release them as 'non-making of' books :-)
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Post by Lensman on Apr 29, 2005 18:48:06 GMT
It's hardly surprising that the lack of info from Pendragon, plus the repeated delays, fuel all kinds of rumors. But if we were to believe that the film exists only as "a couple of reels,"* then we'd have to believe that any number of people are in on the conspiracy of maintaining the fraud, including the composer who says he's scored the film. If the film has been scored, then it's finished or practically so.
*It's very unlikely this is literally true, as the movie was shot digitally, and there's no economic incentive to convert it to reels of actual film before the movie is finished.
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Post by Lensman on Apr 29, 2005 19:09:17 GMT
IFor a start, can you imagine the legal implications? <snip> b. Please give us money for a DVD of the movie we HAVE already made. (to JOE PUBLIC) Wouldn't that be construed as fraud? Anyone with more legal knowledge please comment/correct etc... Standard disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, and if I were I wouldn't be offering legal advice on a subject for which I don't know all the pertinent facts, and even if I did it's highly unlikely I'd offer such advice for free, or in a public forum. However, my layman's understanding is that fraud can occur only when there is some sort of contract or exchange of tangible items (like money) involved. Book contracts involve payment of money (the advance) to the author, and various costs to the publisher such as editing, artwork, printing, and copyright registration. And publishers' contracts with book distributors and sellers promise an actual tangible item (the book) on a specified date. All those are contracts and therefore intentional deception on the part of one party to another may be fraud. OTOH Joe Blow could announce on the Internet that he'd completed the greatest film of all time and that it was coming out tomorrow, but even if it existed only in Joe's imagination, that wouldn't constitute fraud. And even if fans spent months and years on a forum discussing, debating and arguing about Joe's film, no mere participant in that forum would have any legal case against Mr. Blow because they have no contract with him, nor have they given him anything tangible such as money. Now if Joe Blow makes a contract with a DVD distributor and fails to deliver, that may constitute fraud-- but only against the distributor, and if he accepts money for a DVD and doesn't deliver what was promised, *that* may be fraud-- but only against those who gave him money for the DVD.
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Post by tinckelly on Apr 29, 2005 19:53:05 GMT
Lensman I don't think this rumour is true for the reasons that I stated earlier.
But i think if it were true, it would constitute fraud.
I work in Licensed film-related publishing, and deal with all the major studios. If we buy the License to make and publish a book about film "X" from Dreamworks, and spend £200K putting it together, but we can't finish and release the book (that we have already pre-sold) because it turns out Dreamworks lied about actually having that film, the following things would happen.
1. We would sue Dreamworks. 2. Our booksellers would sue us. 3. Our foreign sub-licencees would sue us. 4. If we refused to pay our authors and artists who had contributed to the book their outstanding fees, or unearned royalties on a title that never existed, (all of which HAS actually happened) they would sue us as well.
Hard to see how people wouldn't see the cause of all that as fraud.
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Post by dudalb on May 3, 2005 4:52:26 GMT
Maybe Hines Real name is Max Bialystock. And he will be the subject of "The Producers II". ;D
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Post by timeship2 on May 4, 2005 2:28:48 GMT
It really doesn't matter *what* we think. Whether we support the film fully or criticize him doesn't seem to have any desired effect. We've all had the wool pulled over our eyes constantly. This time, it looks like Tim Hines has finally cried wolf once too many.
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Post by RustiSwordz on May 6, 2005 0:11:04 GMT
Bill Warren, author of various reference books on sci-fi films including "Keep Watching The Skies" and "The Evil Dead Companion", made a post at the Mobius Home Video Forum in which he says that Starlog editor Dave McDonnell told him that he learned that the film "doesn't really exist beyond a reel or two shot to try to lure enough investors to complete the movie." i would not be surprised.
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Post by dudalb on May 6, 2005 3:38:09 GMT
Would you have invested in Hines' film after seeing the footage? Even if I was a billionaire Wells fantatic who wanted a period version of the book above all else on earth, I would have said 'Forget it, Timbo;I will wait until some film maker who actually has talent wants to do the project".....
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Post by paco417 on May 6, 2005 12:11:42 GMT
Don't you just hate it when people make a fool of us? as far as i am concerned pendragon is making us all look stupid into believing this film will ever see the light of day!! Sorry pendragon but i like a good majority of fans on this site are fed up of the constant excuses and delays for this film, firstly it was due in march but was put back!. then it was set for april and again a no show, lets see now will it appear in may?? doubt it! at this rate pendragons film if it ever gets releeased will go straight to DVD into the Bargin Bin!! i have lost all faith in this project ever seeing the light of day and will be eagerly waiting for Speilbergs and Jeff waynes work to arrive.... at least you can trust them!
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Zoe
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Post by Zoe on May 6, 2005 18:03:17 GMT
Seeing as there are now five different film versions of (The) War of the Worlds coming out - alledgedly - and none of them is ideal - what would be ideal? Could it perhaps be The Production Values of the Spielberg Versions plus the good natured, unpretentious oomph of the CT Howell version plus the period setting of the Hines version with perhaps the music of the Jeff Wayne version and the slick pacing of the Paramount version? Or maybe..... The Production Values of the Hines Version and er er.... It's a bit like politics...... Being forced to vote for one party when you'd rather vote for some mixture of policies.... So in the end people go right off politics..... maybe we'll all end up so jaded that we'll go off TWOTW...... maybe this site will change it's name to 'The Bore of the Worlds Online' Zoe
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Post by Rob on May 6, 2005 18:09:56 GMT
Good point Zoe, in that respect it's alot like politics
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