|
|
Post by FALLINGSTAR on Mar 14, 2005 4:11:16 GMT
So what you're saying is, when *I* suggest distributors might be reluctant to compete with a major studio like Paramount, I'm engaging in "conspiracy theory." But when Forbes says that in their article, that's "very reliable reporting". I think you've been listening to too many of Hines' bashers on this forum, Dudalb. *They* are the ones with the conspiracy theories, such as "Hines just did it for a tax dodge" or "They never really shot the movie, they just pretended to" or "Hines actually wrote all of the actors' diaries" or-- this is my favorite-- "Hines made up this hype about WotW just to get attention for what he's really working on, which is Chrome." Ha. No conspiracy theories in *my* opinions, Dudalb. Yes the one about Hines making this all up to get publicity for Chrome was mine Lensman, but in all fairness to me I never claimed it as fact and clearly stated that it was just an argument I was putting forward. Just because I put forward an argument doesn't mean I'm a Hines basher. If you've read some of my posts you'll see that I've virtually zero interest in Spielbergs flick but I also have a sceptisism towards Pendragon which I think is perfectly understandable considerng what we know or don't know about them. After all how do you know that some of these theories aren't true. You have to admit the whole Pendragon thing is a bit odd. |
|
|
|
Post by Ashe Raven on Mar 14, 2005 8:16:45 GMT
I am very very pleased that the film is comming out, in whatever form. Extreamly pleased.
What I am not happy about is the fact the Hine's has in someway kept lying to us about an impending worldwide cinema release. I wasn't expecting a blockbuster, burt for God's sake, even announcing he'd be releasing a DVD would have been great.
|
|
|
|
Post by dudalb on Mar 14, 2005 9:00:08 GMT
"So what you're saying is, when *I* suggest distributors might be reluctant to compete with a major studio like Paramount, I'm engaging in "conspiracy theory."
That is not what you said.
You said that:
"it was distributors' fear of Paramount's wrath that has made it difficult or impossible for Pendragon to get distribution for its film. "
There is a big difference between the two. One implies Paramount making some kind of threat against distriubutors, and the other that distriubtors, without any threats being made by Paramount, decided that
the Hines film would be crushed at the box office by the Speilberg film.
Which the latter is sound judgement based upon the footage we have seen.
Hines simply had a poor product to sell if the clips we have seen are any indication.
I have not bought into any of the Anti Hines Conspiracy theories either.
Hines is simply a small time filmaker without a great deal of experience who got in over his head with a project that would require a great deal more in resources then he could scrap up. Read a modern day "Ed Wood".
I don't mind that. I do mind the way the Hines has misled the fans about this project.
And, sadly, I have come to the conclusion that a lot of the misleading has been deliberate.
"It's amazing how wilful blindness can cloud people's judgement"
Not so much wilful blindness but such a overwhelming desire to see a period version of WOTW that they ignored the signs that Pendragon films was a small company not up to the challenge.
And I don't share the opinion that "a bad period version is better then no period version" since a bad film that is a finiancial fiasco has the chilling effect of making it very,very, difficult for any good filmaker who wants to do a period WOTW with live action to get any funding after the Hines mess.
The Jeff Wayne CGI animated version is a totally different animal, and I guarantee you we will not see the kind of fiasco with that we have with the Pendragon version. Wayne is a professional with a long history of sucessful stage projects . Granted , he has not done a film before, but he knows enough to know that he needs experienced people to do the project, and he will get them. Wayne is a pro, Hines aparently is semi pro at best.
|
|
|
|
Post by jeffwaynefan on Mar 14, 2005 9:02:13 GMT
If this is the case of it going straight to DVD , then those delighfull chaps at Ebay will certainly have copies floating about. All the NEC shows I do have DVD importers there so I will have no problem obtaining copies, plus there are certain DVD shops in high streets that have started to cater for people who collect imported DVDs , so there should be no problem in getting it. You will get a copy depending on how 'badly' you want one.
H_C
|
|
|
|
Post by Ashe Raven on Mar 14, 2005 9:04:12 GMT
You gurrantee it?
In life there are no guarrantees. Sure the Wayne record is fantastic, but it's games are not great and the CGI in them was questionble at best. The CGI for the FW film looks good so far, but i have yet to see something that will really grab me to be honest, but I'l wait and see.
As for this being a bad period piece, I;'ll reserve my judgment for the actual viewing of the actual film, not the trailer
|
|
Zoe
Full Member
Posts: 105
|
Post by Zoe on Mar 14, 2005 9:11:18 GMT
So what you're saying is, when *I* suggest distributors might be reluctant to compete with a major studio like Paramount, I'm engaging in "conspiracy theory." But when Forbes says that in their article, that's "very reliable reporting". I think you've been listening to too many of Hines' bashers on this forum, Dudalb. *They* are the ones with the conspiracy theories, such as "Hines just did it for a tax dodge" or "They never really shot the movie, they just pretended to" or "Hines actually wrote all of the actors' diaries" or-- this is my favorite-- "Hines made up this hype about WotW just to get attention for what he's really working on, which is Chrome." Ha. No conspiracy theories in *my* opinions, Dudalb. Seeing as I am obviously a firing line here I might clarify by reminding people what a 'conspiracy theory' really is. A 'conspiracy theory' is a non-falsifiable pseudo theory that posits a secret group as the cause of a wide range of apparently unrelated events. It is perfectly reasonable and not indulging in 'conspiracy theories' at all to suggest reasons for Hines not producing the promised goods on time. Saying he might be continuing so as to write it off as a tax loss - not as a tax dodge by the way - is not a 'conspiracy theory' as it would be Hines doing it and not some secret cabal. It is a theory - and it is falsifiable. Hines only has to produce the film to falsify it and if he did I would accept that I was wrong and I would be glad for Hines and everyone else who wants to see this film. So I am not Hines bashing either. I have said before that the poor guy is probably half out of his mind with worry trying to please everyone else - including the backers. It's not a conspiracy - it's just market forces outside everyone's control. I'd like to have the option of seeing the film, I'm just not wildly enthusiastic about it because as I've said before - I prefer the book to someone else's interpretation and I would actually rather watch something like the Pal version with a re-imagining of the basic story than a cold, intellectual, perfectionist and literalist version of the film which for me is unimaginative and sterile. I would say that about any attempt to transfer the book to the film. Hines in my opinion is well meaning but misguided as I can't ever see most people making the effort to see such a film - minority opinions on this board or off notwithstanding. Maybe I am wrong - but dismissing anyone who disagrees with you as 'Hines bashing' is just childish. Zoe |
|
|
|
Post by HTT on Mar 14, 2005 9:57:32 GMT
[glow=purple,2,300]Oh dear, yet another article taken as gospel. If Tim has released this info to the magazine, why is it not on the website? Why hasn't Charles been informed?
One thing that I find odd is this quote:[/glow]
[glow=purple,2,300]- talk about pot calling the kettle black!! There would have been NO confusion if Paramount kept to their original schedule, and they have stated that the films are so different that customers won't be confused. They were never worried before, so how come they're suddenly worried about it? No, this statement doesn't ring true.
Once again, I'll wait until I hear the definitive word from either source. And if it is a DVD release, well, I've got a region free player so I don't care where it's released, as long as I get my hands on it!![/glow]
|
|
|
|
Post by Gerkinman on Mar 14, 2005 10:17:01 GMT
haha, ebay *hugs ebay*
|
|
|
|
Post by RustiSwordz on Mar 14, 2005 10:53:00 GMT
Hines is simply a small time filmaker without a great deal of experience who got in over his head with a project that would require a great deal more in resources then he could scrap up. Read a modern day "Ed Wood". I don't mind that. I do mind the way the Hines has misled the fans about this project. And, sadly, I have come to the conclusion that a lot of the misleading has been deliberate. "It's amazing how wilful blindness can cloud people's judgement" Not so much wilful blindness but such a overwhelming desire to see a period version of WOTW that they ignored the signs that Pendragon films was a small company not up to the challenge. And I don't share the opinion that "a bad period version is better then no period version" since a bad film that is a finiancial fiasco has the chilling effect of making it very,very, difficult for any good filmaker who wants to do a period WOTW with live action to get any funding after the Hines mess. sad to say but i %100 agree |
|
|
|
Post by McTodd on Mar 14, 2005 10:54:26 GMT
[glow=purple,2,300]Oh dear, yet another article taken as gospel. If Tim has released this info to the magazine, why is it not on the website? Why hasn't Charles been informed?[/glow] Forbes is a hard-headed journal for hard-headed people, I think they’ll have checked their facts first, and I don’t think they were relying on Hines for their info. After all, it’s hardly a glowing press release for the guy. As for the website, why should it be on there? Without going over old ground yet again, but there are many things Pendragon should have done but didn’t, why should this be any different? We all know how high the BS Quotient has been with Hines, so you’re deluding yourself if you think he’s going to suddenly level with everyone now. And no disrespect to Charles, but why should Timbo inform him of anything? Hines will tell Charles, as he has everyone else, whatever suits him at the time. |
|
|
|
Post by HTT on Mar 14, 2005 12:32:36 GMT
[glow=purple,2,300]Why should it be on the WebSite? Coz it's the official website for official announcements. If TH has madde an official announcement re the release of the movie, it should be on there - it doesn't take long to update it!
Why should Timmy inform Charles? Coz Charles is the main man in the Wells Society, and provided a lot of the technical details, and is one of the main people Tim will be trying to please (apart from himself)!
If they have checked the facts, and not relied on Hines, then they haven't checked the facts, as Hines is the only one who knows for sure. All mags check their facts... but not many seem to get them right! [/glow]
|
|
|
|
Post by McTodd on Mar 14, 2005 15:28:33 GMT
[glow=purple,2,300]Why should it be on the WebSite? Coz it's the official website for official announcements. If TH has madde an official announcement re the release of the movie, it should be on there - it doesn't take long to update it! Why should Timmy inform Charles? Coz Charles is the main man in the Wells Society, and provided a lot of the technical details, and is one of the main people Tim will be trying to please (apart from himself)! If they have checked the facts, and not relied on Hines, then they haven't checked the facts, as Hines is the only one who knows for sure. All mags check their facts... but not many seem to get them right! [/glow] But that's my point - the website is their portal to the world. But they've fecked it up good and proper. I know who Charles is - all I'm saying is don't assume Hines isn't just as ready to let Charles down as anyone else. As for your last point, well isn't that a bind, eh? Because we know what a consummate BS artist Hines is, so if the only news we can rely on is from Hines then we can't rely on it. In any case, very little of the information in that article is from Hines - and what there is from him we know already. Most of their information is from UAV. Given their track record (low-brow but money-making, therefore businesslike and professional) I suspect that they're more reliable in this instance than the Munchausen of the Camera. |
|
|
|
Post by Gnorn on Mar 14, 2005 15:55:47 GMT
I do believe Forbes is a very professional magazine, and wouldn't put out an article if it hadn't any prooving ground.
The bad news is, we are not getting it on DVD in Europe, if I have to believe the article. And if that is due to the soulless Paramount laywers breathing flames down the necks of Hines & Co, then forget their pitty excuse for a WotW movie. I'm NOT gonna watch their movie! :-(
-Gnorn#nosmileys
|
|
|
|
Post by McTodd on Mar 14, 2005 16:06:05 GMT
Amazon.com.
But if it costs more than £35, get them to mark it as a gift, otherwise HM Customs will have your knackers.
You have to write a gift note, to yourself.
I usually write something along the lines of, 'To my favourite person in all the world - me! Love, Me xxx'
Fecking Customs...
|
|
|
|
Post by dudalb on Mar 14, 2005 17:59:14 GMT
I have a problem how anybody can takes Hines at his word at this point. He has promised and not delivered time and time again. The theatrical trailer, "State of the Art" special effects, a March 3oth World wide release date, ..and I could go on and on. "If they have checked the facts, and not relied on Hines, then they haven't checked the facts, ".
Or they have contacted Hines and simply do not believe what he says because it conflicts with other facts.
In fact any reporter who 'relies" on somebody with out a little digging is not doing his job.
I would say that Forbes' Magazine credibility is about 1000% better then Hines' at the moment,and to ignore Hines' record of either deliberate or unintentional misleading is living in a fantasy world.
"I know who Charles is - all I'm saying is don't assume Hines isn't just as ready to let Charles down as anyone else."
He already has...remember the "Big News" Hines promised Charles last week?
The true beleivers in Hines are getting fewer and fewer.
I love they way they refer to Hines as "Tim", like he was a buddy of theirs rather then sombody t hey have never met.
Time to take off the rose colored glassed, guys.
It's straight to DVD, and probably deserves that fate.
|
|
|
|
Post by dudalb on Mar 14, 2005 18:08:07 GMT
"And if that is due to the soulless Paramount laywers breathing flames down the necks of Hines & Co, then forget their pitty excuse for a WotW movie."
Actually it is due to the fact that according to the Wells Society WOTW the novel is still undercopy right in the UK and Europe,which it is not in the US, and Hines would have to come to an arrangement with the owners of the novel's copyright to release a film. I believe that Wayne did make such a deal and has the film licence in EUrope and the UK, and came to a deal with Paramount for Paramount to use it.
So Wayne is more likely to blame then Hines.
As to the forget Paramount, that is a real mature way to react to bad news.
I have to love how everybody is to blame for this fiasco except Hines.
I am sure that Paramount is really sad that a few die hard Hines supporters will boycott their film, and will cry about it all the way to the bank to deposit the gigantic grosses that their film, good or bad, will probably bring in.
Zoe: I did not say that the Wayne film would be a good film. I am saying it will be handled on a much more profesional basis then Pendragon has: i,e, it will get a proper marketing campaign and proper distriubtion. I make no claims as to the final quality of the film.
I guarantee you one thing: When Wayne gives us a opening date for this film it will open on that date.
|
|
Zoe
Full Member
Posts: 105
|
Post by Zoe on Mar 14, 2005 19:12:39 GMT
Zoe: I did not say that the Wayne film would be a good film. I am saying it will be handled on a much more profesional basis then Pendragon has: i,e, it will get a proper marketing campaign and proper distriubtion. I make no claims as to the final quality of the film. Have you got me mixed up with someone else? I have never said anything about the Wayne film. I know nothing about it and have no opinion how it will turn out. I have heard it is supposed to be quite good and the sample animations look fine. I see no point in criticising it because as you say there are no problems with distribution and so I just think wait and see. I tend to feel the same about the Paramount version. In fact the only one there is any doubt about is the Pendragon one surely? Wait and see.... but don't hold your breath. ;D Zoe |
|
|
|
Post by RossH on Mar 14, 2005 19:35:48 GMT
Well call me a hopeless optimist, but this news on a DVD release is probably the best news we've heard on the Pendragon/Hines WOTW movie in a long time.
We've heard a lot of promises, and even more silence, but this is the first sign that we may actually have the chance to actually see this movie.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm as cynical as they come. I never expected a wide release in the cinemas, nor did I expect an accurate WOTW movie (whatever its merits and quality) to be easy to sell to the general public. And while Hines hasn't exactly been very business savvy (to put it mildly), I suspect he's had a lot of doors slammed in his face when the Spielberg movie started up.
And if a DVD release is the only real release, then it does give Pendragon a few extra months to polish the film.
Good or bad, I do want to see this movie but I'm also not expecting a masterpiece. But I'm not going to condem the movie without seeing it first either!
|
|
|
|
Post by thed0ct0r on Mar 14, 2005 22:32:30 GMT
Well I've had it with this. What a waste of time and energy.  Motile, Rusty, Dudalb - you guys were great.  Keep it real. As for Pendrgon - f**k you, Timothy Hines. (This is how it's done, Rusty. I'm NEVER coming back! ;D) |
|
|
|
Post by RustiSwordz on Mar 15, 2005 7:18:44 GMT
Well I've had it with this. What a waste of time and energy. Motile, Rusty, Dudalb - you guys were great. Keep it real. As for Pendrgon - f**k you, Timothy Hines. (This is how it's done, Rusty. I'm NEVER coming back! ;D) Do i know you from somewhere else doc? |
|
